Tara Breuso: Binge eating, snack hacking & common struggles with food

Jul 03, 2023


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 Episode 144 with Tara Breuso.

“ADHDers have such intense empathy. When I was 10, if I saw another child upset at a party, I would zero in on them and want to make them feel better.”

Tara is a registered dietitian and certified intuitive eating counselor based in Australia. She runs an online private practice working with ADHD clients, helping them to gain clarity around eating and to stop dieting and binge eating for good. As an ADHDer herself, she understands that food, eating, and weight can be a turbulent experience for people living with ADHD. Her passion is helping people with ADHD find food freedom using a scientifically proven approach.

We talk about the principles of intuitive eating and food freedom and how these concepts can often be misunderstood or rejected by people with ADHD. We also talk about common difficulties we have with feeding ourselves, including sensory issues around food, executive dysfunction around meal prep, and decision fatigue.

And we talk all about snack hacking and Tara’s beautiful printable food lists — one of them is a visual aid for combining ordinary items in our pantry, and she also has a visual shopping list and simple recipes — it’s fantastic so make sure to check them out! 

Instagram: @The_ADHD_Dietitian

TikTok: @The_ADHD_Dietitian


Get 30% off Tara’s Snack Hacker with code ADHDWOMEN30: https://the-adhd-dietitian.myshopify.com/

Tara’s small group coaching program.

Women & ADHD listeners receive a $300 discount on Tara’s with code ADHDWOMEN300

Resources mentioned:

Embrace documentary by Tara Brumfitt



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Katy Weber (she/her) (00:01.187)
Bye Tara, thank you so much for joining me.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (00:03.79)
Hello, Katie, it's such a pleasure to be joining you.

Katy Weber (she/her) (00:08.763)
I'm so excited. Okay, so now I would love to just start out hearing about your diagnosis story. How long ago were you diagnosed with ADHD and what was happening in your life where you started to think I should really look into this?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (00:24.074)
Well, I'm 30, how old am I? God, I'm 36 at the end of this year. And I, I think I have one of the rarest diagnosis stories ever. Um, I was diagnosed when I was 21. So still a late diagnosis, but pretty early compared to most late diagnosis diagnoses that I speak with. And I was at uni, I was studying nutrition and I was getting You know, 90 and above for the units that I was interested in. And then I was struggling with units like chemistry where I wanted to learn, but I just couldn't take the information on board. So I just stare at my notes and then I'd highlight them and I just wouldn't go in. And so I went to see my doctor because it was giving me quite a lot of anxiety. I thought that there might be something sort of wrong with me. Why can't I take on this information? And my GP.

ADHD herself or had some special interest in it because she said, I think you might have ADHD. And I was, I didn't know anything about it at that point. And I like the, you know, the typical idea people had or have of ADHD. I thought, no, that's for little boys with hyperactivity. That's not me. And she referred me to the psychiatrist and after that appointment, he diagnosed with ADHD and he prescribed me with dexamphetamines.

aderol, I think. And I used those for studying but I didn't genuinely connect with the diagnosis and I sort of thought I saw people around me using them sort of recreationally for studying even when they weren't diagnosed and I thought oh these just help everyone so they had a profound effect on me but I thought oh they just help everyone and I didn't really believe that ADHD was a real thing and didn't really connect with it.

And then fast forward to finishing uni and my grade sort of leveling out from taking medication and from, but actually that's all it was. I didn't even import any strategies except for that. And then I had my son, um, he's now five years old, but when he was two, I started to notice he's really different and his, his emotional regulation is really different from the other kids around us at play groups and mothers groups. And.

I sort of said to my husband, I, this doesn't feel like normal behavior. This feels way more intense. And then now he's five and he started school and he's been through two years of school and, and teachers have raised. Not concerns with us, but just said, you know, um, your son's learning is really different. Um, and he is very hyperactive. He's extremely hyperactive. And that made me start to look into ADHD more. And suddenly I was interested in it and believed that.

was a real sort of thing. And I learned like most people are learning about myself through, you know, finding our community on TikTok and Instagram and, oh my God, no, really that is a specific thing. Cause before I sort of was like, oh yeah, symptoms, there's symptoms, but sort of like horoscopes, you could fit them to anyone. You know, they don't, they're not. And then once you start to find that community on

Katy Weber (she/her) (03:45.333)

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (03:49.426)
on Instagram and TikTok, you realize, no, this is very specific to me. I've had this exact experience and I've told friends about this experience and they haven't understood. Um, so I started to learn about myself and then I realized I was, I wanted to work with ADHD is in regards to binge eating because it's such a big issue for ADHD is, and so I started an Instagram and it just automatically sort of fed the videos to TikTok and I went on there one day and it was sort of.

blowing up for me anyway. And from there, I've built a community around ADHD dietetics, and I'm working with ADHDs in binge eating, and it's my dream job. It's so fulfilling. So that's, that's my story really. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (04:34.675)
Well, it's funny because I'm sure you were like, Oh, that makes a lot of sense as to why I even went into nutrition and dietetics, right? That fascination I think that we have with food rules and getting it right and all of that obsessive behaviors with ADHD. For me, that was so fascinating and just in terms of my own history with weight cycling and extreme dieting. And I mean, all of that has been so interesting looking at my own history with that.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (04:42.703)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (04:58.665)

Katy Weber (she/her) (05:03.923)
and of course, binge eating through this ADHD lens. Where I'm like, oh, we are tailor-made audiences for the diet industry. Hehehe.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (05:14.03)
1000 million percent. Yes. It's just, we have no hope in hell. If we're living in this world of diet culture being thrown at us. And if we are prone to that binge eating, it's really, really hard. No, we do have, we definitely have, but to not feel in some way in our lives that, that diet culture is impacting us. ADHD is just, it's so, and it's so prevalent binge eating. It's so, so difficult for so many people.

Katy Weber (she/her) (05:16.451)

Right? Yeah. I mean, just disordered eating in general, I think is so much more prevalent among neurodivergence for so many reasons, right? Like it's, I find it really fascinating. And I also feel like I hear from a lot of women that like the approaches in terms of recovery aren't necessarily, like aren't really tailored toward a neurodivergent brain. And so like, what does that even mean? What is it? What is, you know,

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (05:43.794)


Katy Weber (she/her) (06:09.015)
what are some approaches in terms of recovery from binge eating and disordered eating that might be different for somebody with binge eating or somebody with ADHD? Uh, but well, that was actually, that is a question that I want to get to later, but first I want to hear a little bit more about your own story, which I think is so, I mean, it's so telling, right? In terms of how much research we put into our kids and not into ourselves. As so many women end up coming to that, uh, that, that, that

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (06:21.23)
I'm gonna go.


Katy Weber (she/her) (06:38.719)
Not even the diagnosis, because obviously you were diagnosed so much earlier, but just that like deep connection, uh, through researching for our children. That's interesting. So looking back besides the dietetics, was there, what were some of the other signs throughout your life? Um, maybe as a kid that you were like, Oh yeah, no, clearly the signs were there all along.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (06:43.87)
Yes. Yes. Yeah, it's...

I think definitely that... That...

empathy that I think a lot of ADHDers have where, you know, I'd be 10 years old in a room at a party. And if one person was upset, I was so honed in on that person and just wanted to make them feel better. And I think I see that a lot of when I'm with my with a group of other ADHDers, I noticed that we're all sort of checking in with each other all the time to make sure that everyone's okay. But then also, um...

I grew up being so embarrassed that people didn't want to tell me secrets because I would always tell everyone else as a child, you know, it'd be, I'd be the one to just my impulse control is so low. It's like in one year and I'm suddenly telling someone else. And now as an adult, I'm not ashamed of that. I sort of say like, if this is a really important secret and

you have to weigh up whether you want my advice or because I might, I won't intentionally tell anyone, but I, I find it really hard to remember that something's a secret because I'm so open myself and I have this belief that, you know, obviously there are things that people need to keep private and I do respect that, but it's more like.

I feel like we all need to be so much more open to make people feel that they're included and understood and that they see that other people are being affected by the same things. So I forget that things are secret, I guess. I forget that privacy is so important to some people. So that's definitely a thread, been a thread throughout my life. A lot of apologizing like, oh my God, did you not want anyone to know that? I, okay, sorry. I'm so sorry. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (08:40.647)
You're right. You know, I feel like that is a very common quality amongst neurodivergence is that openness. I think you explained it so well because it's not just a carelessness. And I really dislike the term oversharing for that same reason because I'm like, what is oversharing? Like I'm an open book. I will talk about very, very uncomfortable topics like it's the weather. And so I've always.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (08:53.666)

Katy Weber (she/her) (09:06.579)
I always had a lot of shame around the fact that I was so open and I always thought of myself as a, as an oversharer. But now I look at it through this new lens and I'm like, no, actually, I think it's really, it's a, it's a wonderful quality to be able to talk about things and talk about shameful things in, in a very matter of fact way, because I feel like it de-stigmatizes a lot of those things.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (09:26.435)
100%. That's exactly how I feel. You just summed it up. Yes. Yep.

Katy Weber (she/her) (09:31.635)
But the sharing secrets thing, I think, well, I think it's sort of like, on the one hand, you're right, I cannot keep any secrets. And I feel like one of the things that gets me into trouble sometimes with the podcast, because I'm such an open book, is that I talk about my family and I'm always like, where do I end? Where does my family's privacy begin? Because I have to be really careful about that stuff.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (09:52.31)
And I made, honestly, my husband who is so, so, he's an extremely private person. He's at the other end of the spectrum and he just made the huge mistake of marrying me with my, with my oversharing. And he doesn't see it as a mistake, but often it's like.

Katy Weber (she/her) (10:05.729)

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (10:12.622)
You told that person about such and such. I'm like, Oh my gosh, were we not, you have to remind me that I almost he's in, in the past, he's sort of given me a pep talk before we go in. So just remember that we don't, we're not talking about this yet. And I'm like, okay, that's right. Okay. Good. Cause we're not sure.

Katy Weber (she/her) (10:29.283)
I know, right? I've had that on episodes when we talk about sex at ADHD where I have to go up to him and be like, can I talk about this? And he's like, no, of course not. I'm like, okay, I'm glad I checked. But then I have to tell the person I'm interviewing, I have to warn them and be like, this is really hard for me. I'm gonna have a really hard time not talking about my personal experiences. So if I do, we're gonna have to cut it off or something.

Because it just tumbles out of you, right? It's so, it's like the, it's the impulsivity element too, where it like, I don't even think, and next thing I know it's out of my mouth, and then I'm sort of like, and then you get the hangover, right? The next day where you're after the conversation where you're like, I cannot believe I just shared all of that with this relative stranger. But. Ha ha ha. Ha ha ha. Ha ha ha. Ha ha ha. Ha ha ha. Ha ha ha.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (10:56.825)
Edit. I ate yours.

Yes. Oh my God. Yes. Yes. Yes. 100%. They're going to think I'm so strange, but most of the time people come to you later on and say like, you've made me feel so seen and, and I've never heard someone, you know, be so open about these things and it makes me want to share.

And that's a really special moment as well. And it reinforces that it's okay to be open and to share experiences. It's I, yeah, that whole privacy thing. I really struggle with the concept of that in general. I just think it's who, yeah, who are we protecting? And in the past we've been private, you know, historically privacy has not protected people and so it's, it's important to find the right balance. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (12:00.155)
Yeah, I think that a lot about social media and we're just gonna be totally off the rails now with this conversation. Because I'm like, no, no, no, I love it because it's like, I think about that a lot with social media too, because just in terms of how much of people's lives ends up being.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (12:04.89)

Katy Weber (she/her) (12:12.715)
very public and I'm like, it's great. There is a lot of de-stigmatization with a lot of issues and I think it's really important. But then I'm also like, I'm really grossed out by the performative elements of social media where people are like filming themselves hugging their kids or like filming themselves crying where I'm like, why did we, did we really need to see that? Like, I don't know, I get very uncomfortable with all of the, I think it might be a generational thing. I think people who are like millennials are.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (12:14.17)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (12:27.617)

Katy Weber (she/her) (12:40.683)
you know, I'm 40, I'm going to be 49 this year. So I'm definitely like well into a different generation of social media. So I'm like, maybe there's just generations that are more comfortable with that. But anyway,

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (12:52.374)
know because I don't know if I've always felt like part of my ADHD is having a radar for things that are inauthentic and I just I can't stand that inauthenticity and it just makes me so it makes me cringe so much so I I'm a I'm a millennial and I feel exactly the same like I just think who's holding the camera while you're crying because when I'm crying like I'm in my bed like like like with the pillow over my head like just I'm I'm not

thinking about my phone and angles and filters I'm yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (13:27.067)
Right? I know exactly. Okay, you're right. I think it is all about authenticity and how that really is something that's important to us in so many ways. But yeah, right? That's the first thing I always think about when I see these videos. I was like, at what point did you stop and say, I should film this?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (13:32.929)
It is.


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (13:45.494)
I don't, yeah, it's very awkward unless it was on already and then I don't know. I can't see how it would be organic. I really can't and it does. It gives me the ick. Like it's not, ugh.

Katy Weber (she/her) (13:53.799)
Right? Yeah, but I think there is a fine line between like showing real life, quote unquote, you know, in terms of like, we don't wanna have this beautifully curated social media feed where we're only showing the happy moments, but also, you're right, like just gross. All right, let's get back to talking about food because that's far more interesting topic for me. But so, I wanna talk about intuitive eating because I think...

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (14:07.56)
of a sin.


Katy Weber (she/her) (14:23.251)
Intuitive eating oftentimes when somebody has been dieting their whole lives, right? Especially somebody with ADHD who is, has just been like following food rules, their whole life and getting, you know, and feeling frustrated and weight cycling and all of the stuff that comes with a life of disordered eating and dieting. And then it's like intuitive eating oftentimes I think is presented or understood as just

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (14:28.355)

Katy Weber (she/her) (14:50.655)
releasing all rules, right? And then it becomes sort of chaotic feeling where it's like, I can't, I feel lost. You know, a lot of, I feel like a lot of neurodivergence fear intuitive eating, or they just like decide that that's not for them because they're like, well, that's, I can't live with no rules. I'll just eat everything in sight and blah, blah, blah. Like there's all that fear that has come from dieting. So can we just like backtrack a little bit and can you just explain the concept of intuitive eating?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (14:52.663)



Tara Breuso (Sofair) (15:08.14)

Katy Weber (she/her) (15:19.64)
from within an ADHD lens.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (15:23.358)
Yeah, so intuitive eating is.

Basically listening to your hunger and fullness cues. It sounds like you have a really good understanding, but for the listeners, it's, it's going back in and listening, building in tericeptive awareness. So that awareness of your gastrointestinal tract. So in teriception is, you know, when we feel heat, when we feel cold, our emotions, how our body is feeling and reacting to things and, and a big part of intuitive eating is learning to go inwards and be able to feel those feelings again. And I always say to my clients. We have.

Most of us have a really good understanding or trust in the lower end of our gastrointestinal tract. You know, we know if we're... sorry I'm a dietitian but I'm going to talk about poo. I'm going to talk about poo. We know if we need to open our bowels or release our bladder. We know the difference there. We know if we've got diarrhea. We know if we are constipated. We know that if we've got a big one coming or if it's a small one. We have this real understanding and connection to that

don't question it. Whereas when with the same gastrointestinal tract but a little bit higher up when we're thinking about our stomach and our gut and where food's being processed.

That has been so interfered with by external factors that we turn the volume down on that and we can't hear that anymore. Whereas with our bowel movements, no one challenges those for the, for the majority of people. No one's going, Oh my gosh, do you go to the toilet five times a day? That's weird. I only go three times and we go, Oh, well I better start going when Sally goes to the toilet so that I can be like her and have her body. We don't think like that, but when it comes to eating, we do. Um, and it's changing all the time.

So we lose touch with those hunger fullness cues. And I've forgotten what the question was. What is it?

Katy Weber (she/her) (17:16.871)
Yeah, well, but you know, it actually it reminded me of my son when, and I don't know if you've had this experience with your son, but I do think that interoception doesn't come easily to somebody with ADHD, even at the beginning. And I remember when he was younger, you know, all of those things that are sort of typical kid things where you're like, okay, go to the bathroom before we get in this car ride. And then they're like, no, I'm fine. I don't have to go. And then as soon as you start driving, they're like,

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (17:29.022)

Katy Weber (she/her) (17:42.563)
to go now, right? That urgency where it's like, you really have to start. Like I remember having to intentionally teach my son how to pay attention to early signs because I think, and even as an adult, like we have a tendency, you know, talking about bladders, like, I feel like that's one of those jokes that we have with ADHD, which is like, we have a tendency to ignore our bladders until it's really, really loud because we're distracted. And so.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (17:42.759)
Yes. Yes. Yes.


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (18:03.226)
Absolutely. Yes. Absolutely. Yes!

Katy Weber (she/her) (18:08.803)
So even that, right? So I think the way that you've just described it in terms of like, it's not something that necessarily is going, is instinctual, that there is something that you have to work on and like, what does that look like?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (18:21.578)

Yes. So, and ADHD is often have reduced and pteroseptive awareness that we, we often struggle a lot more and that's why, um, intuitive eating can feel even harder for people with ADHD, but, but I also, um, have worked in the past with clients that don't have ADHD and many, many people in that, in the neurotypical group also struggle with that and pteroseptive awareness, but, um, we do have to work that little bit harder, but.


Firstly, working with a health professional and that's not just me plugging myself, that's genuinely, you need a set of guidelines because another thing with ADHD is that we feel safe in diets because it gives us that structure. It's in the same way that we buy diaries, you know, and then we don't use them. But for the first day that you buy it, you're like, I feel safe in this, this is going to be my brain and this is going to do it for me. And that's that set of rules feel so safe to an ADHD because we often feel like we're

And so if we say, okay, well, this person's telling me exactly how to eat. Um, and we have low, you know, trusted ourselves and low self esteem. So to have to have that pressure of, of having all of the food control of food on us is, is a huge amount of pressure compared to the average person. Um, but you need to work with a health professional that does give you a guideline so that you ease out of.

dieting and you slowly go into intuitive eating and it, it doesn't feel like this very, very controlled pro from going very, very controlled to complete food freedom. It's not as simple as that. And it's not as simple as you have to work through it in, in specific stages. And we first have to make sure that we're eating regularly so that we can even start to notice those hunger and fullness cues. And we need to make sure that we're. Eating. The right.

variety of macronutrients and have a dietitian help us with that. So it's not, there'll be no measuring and no rules there and there's no shame and no judgment. But you do need to be given guidelines so that you can actually start to listen again.

And you need to do specific food challenges and a dietitian will guide you through that so that you feel safe in that. And then when you go, that didn't work, you come back to the dietitian and they say, well, firstly, there's no judgment. We're not allowed to judge ourselves. We're just learning. I like to say to my clients that a lot of it's experimenting because we often don't have a very strong relationship with food and so to go, to go back and have a non-judgmental approach to food.

experiment to go like, how does Katie's body feel when she eats raisins on their own? Is that what you guys call them? Raisins? Yeah. Um, and, or, or how does she feel when she has, you know, raisins and cashews? How does she feel an hour later? And, and doing that for a few days and working out that it sounds very tedious, but just like driving a car, when you first do it, you're like, okay.

Katy Weber (she/her) (21:16.183)
Sure. Yeah.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (21:36.306)
My blink is here and, and I've got to make sure I'm in gear and I've got to do all of these things. And then one day you find yourself driving home and, and you didn't even know how you got there because it's just, it's that muscle memory. So yes, there is this learning process, but I think another thing, but sorry, yes, there is this learning process, but we, you're doing this conscious work, putting the information into your subconscious. And then suddenly you're doing it on autopilot. Um, excuse me.

Yeah, I'm just gonna have a sip of my tea. I've got something in my throat.

Katy Weber (she/her) (22:09.631)
Um, yeah, no, I think then that reminded me of what my original question was too, which was, was that intuitive eating isn't just chaos, right? That it is, there is some structure there. There is, um, scaffolding, which I think like you said, I love how you said it was felt safe, right? Because I think you're right. I think dieting did feel safe for a lot of us when it came to the feeling like we.

had control and a lot of this comes down to like feeling it and chaotic in our lives. What are some quick, easy things we can control in our life? Food, eating, weight, all of those things become, that's where we turn very quickly, right? And so, you know, having struck, I think that it's important to note that intuitive eating isn't just chaos and like no diet rules, that it is actually like a very structured approach, which can really.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (22:40.014)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (23:01.023)

Katy Weber (she/her) (23:02.947)
uh, be helpful, uh, with, like you said, with guidance, it's not just like, I'm going to stop dieting because then you're really still dieting. You're just in like cheat mode.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (23:06.378)

Yeah, you're, yes. Um, it's, I also like to say to people that because people think that when they start eating intuitively, or if they have no food rules, that nothing is kind of going to control the amount of food that goes into their body.

Well, that's not true. We don't want to focus on control because control has this negative stigma associated with it, but your body's controlling that. Your body knows when it's had enough of a certain food. If you tune into it, you'll know. It's just that you don't feel the need to eat past that feeling of satisfaction because you've worked.

through a process to know that you can have that food again, whenever you feel like that food. So the sadness of saying this is enough of this food isn't as strong because we don't feel that we have to eat it all because we're never going to have it again. And that's, you know, we sort of have these funerals for food when we're dieting, we go, I'm never eating chocolate again. So I better eat as much chocolate as I can, because I'm, I'm so emotional. I'm never going to eat this food again. Taking those emotions out and just saying,

No, I'm just going to stop eating the chocolate because it's too sweet in my mouth now. And my body is telling me that that's enough. And then sitting through that, but knowing that you can have that food again, is the way that you, that's the cycle where you know that that restriction is always the root of binging. We're always, if you, if you're binging, there's always some restriction somewhere that we need to work on and.

It's interesting, there's so many different kinds of restrictions that people have, both mental and physical. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (24:54.227)
Right, exactly. And I think that was a big one for me with my own binge eating journey was realizing that even if I wasn't restricting my food, I was making decisions that were emotionally restrictive decisions in terms of why I was reaching for certain foods. So even though I, you know, gave myself unlimited access to fruits and vegetables and wasn't counting the Weight Watchers points anymore.

you know, although those were always free for all my Weight Watchers people out there, they're there, they'll call, they'll be like, don't be ridiculous. Those are free. But you know, this idea of like thinking of food in terms of points or caloric value and stuff, I got all tumbled up. Hold on. So anyway, my point is I had to really like think about.

Why am I reaching for this food? Right? So, um, you know, am I eating a salad because I'm craving for vegetables and I want greens and I don't want something hot and I want something crunchy. Like I have to like think about, am I making this decision for my health or am I choosing this because of control or weight or some sort of other restrictive decision? And, and so that was like, that was took years for me to figure like to do that.

Intent without having to really think about doing like to have that kind of be part of my food choices. Right. And so I think that's also a muscle that we have to build when we are untangling from diet culture, which is like, why am I making this decision? Is it for my, is it helpful or is it about weight and control?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (26:18.13)

Yes. Yes.

Yes. And, and an important question that people don't ask themselves is, is this food going to be pleasurable for me? Because we have this idea of if a food, the things that usually bring pleasure in a food or in a meal as being not as healthful for us. And so it's really that, that, that leaves an unmet need when things, we don't get pleasure from that meal. And I think one of the things we work on a lot in the small group coaching that

do is, is making sure that the meal is balanced, but also that it provides that satisfaction and it's more, it's layered with ADHD as it's like, do you need crunchy foods? Do you need that deep pressure in, you know, you're having a sandwich, but that's going to be quite soft. Do you need some chips alongside that? And it's so scary for people to think of having a sandwich and thinking, oh, a salad sandwich is going to be.

quote unquote, healthy. I can't, if I have chips with that, then that's going to ruin the health of the meal, but an actual fact that provides that pleasure aspect and also gives you that sensory input and you'll find more than likely that you won't be binging at 9 PM and night because your needs were met. So yeah, it's, it's very layered with ADHD is, but

The breakthroughs that my clients have, it's so satisfying to watch. And for myself going through the process, I at first thought, Oh, this is very sort of woo woo and hippie dippy. And, and I, you know, it's, it, but the science is there and. And it's the breakthrough breakthroughs that you see. It's really beautiful to, to witness. I, yeah. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (28:04.899)
Now, when you're working with clients, one of the things that so many of us experience is unintentional restriction throughout the day, right? And that's something I struggle with a lot, which is literally avoiding eating for a lot of the day because it's decision-making, it's decision fatigue, it's distraction. It also often makes my...

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (28:14.139)


Katy Weber (she/her) (28:28.383)
made tired, right? It creates the serotonin after eating that often, like, I want to stay in my manic productive state as long as possible. So I just drink coffee. And then next thing I know it's 4pm and I'm ravenous, you know? And so like, that's what I struggle with the most too, is that unintentional restriction, which, but I also don't want to eat breakfast because I feel like I really like that manic state of, of

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (28:37.322)

Katy Weber (she/her) (28:58.035)
empty stomachness, right? And so I see why so many people in the ADHD community have embraced intermittent fasting, right? Because it's like, well, this is gives me the A-OK to do it. And then you hear these, you know, and then you hear these suggestions where it's like, no, that's not great. It's not good. But why is it not good? Like, you know, like I really struggle between feeling like the intuitive eating side of me. That's like, well, whatever works for you is great versus always feeling like I'm doing something.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (29:10.382)
I'm sorry.

Katy Weber (she/her) (29:27.595)
wrong or harmful by just being my natural self. Right. And I feel like even that statement is so ADHD, right. Which is like, why I feel like what's wrong with me because my instincts feel wrong. Right. Um, but that's something I think a lot of us experience is the unintentional restriction.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (29:42.082)

Yeah. And then medication restriction. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (29:49.523)
Right? And of course, right? Medication. And then which, and then, but the fear that it leads to binge eating or the medication wears off, we're ravenous at the end of the day. And so then we binge eat. So.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (30:00.054)
Yeah. So my answer is of course, two pronged because I've ADHD. Um, but firstly, Katie, if it works for you to not eat during that time.

Katy Weber (she/her) (30:06.411)
Ha ha ha!

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (30:14.686)
And if you do feel good, genuinely, if that's feeling good in your body, and if you've gone through an intuitive, intuitive eating phase of learning and working on that, and you do know what your hunger and fullness cues look like. And that's what feels good. And then you're not feeling like you're. Binging. And when I say binging, there's no negative association with that. It's just, and there shouldn't be judgment there, but it's just eating past the point that makes you feel comfortable. So.

I don't, I don't want it to be a dirty word binging, but if you feel that you're in the evening, which is what happens with a lot of my clients, they say, I'm in, I'm intermittent fasting and my immediate thought is, and now they're going to tell me they binge at night. And then they go, and I'm binging at night. Um, if you're not finding that that's happening and if it feels good for you, like you said, I'm going against my nat, what my body naturally wants to do. And if that helps you. Then.

that's absolutely fine. And if you, if you don't feel that you're needing any kind of help with that, the second part of it is that

just because we might not be physiologically hungry, even if we have practice intuitive eating and we're quite in touch with our hunger and fullness, it doesn't mean necessarily that our body is not biologically hungry. So we will, our body does need to maintain its blood glucose, we need to stay in homeostasis, our brain needs glucose coming in all the time. So, and all bodies are different and some people can go longer periods without that, but

If we're binging at night, it can be a sign that our bodies just didn't get what it needed throughout the day. And so it's responding in a way that it's saying, get me really quick.

energy and that's going to be refined carbohydrates and refined fats because, because our bodies are clever, you know, if, if it's really hungry, it wants to have something that's absorbed really quickly into the system. And so it's going to crave our bodies are going to crave things like ice cream, chocolate, those foods aren't necessarily going to make us feel great if we use them to fill the hunger gap, but we might be so hungry that we can't make decisions around what would balance that out. Maybe some chocolate and, you know,

a meal of rice and protein and salad, we're not going to make that decision. We're just going to go straight for the food that's going to give us that energy because we've left ourselves way too hungry. Did that make sense? Okay, good. Okay, good.

Katy Weber (she/her) (32:40.559)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Um, yeah, I always think of binge eating also as that the feeling of being out of control in terms of when the end is too, right? Like it never, for me, it was never an amount of food. It was just that feeling of like, I can't stop, right? Like I cannot stop.

there's something in me and that makes me still want to grab for more food. And that's where I always think of like, okay, well, what, like you said, like, what is your body lacking? What is your body? It's almost like your body takes over in those moments, which can be wonderful because I think there's, those are a lot of opportunities to think about like, okay, well, what is my body really need right now in this moment that it's searching for? Like you said, I'm looking for really, really refined sugars and fats and, um,

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (33:12.971)


Katy Weber (she/her) (33:25.799)
And also, you know, I work with a lot of clients who feel terrible about all the sugar they eat at night. And I'm like, well, you're eating sugar at night. I mean, your body is trying to fuel itself to stay awake. So what if you just went to bed, right? But like listening to those, like, like you said, like trying to sort of think of our bodies as sending us messages in terms of what we crave and why I think can be really helpful in terms of how we.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (33:39.486)


Katy Weber (she/her) (33:54.787)
I don't know. I think as somebody with ADHD, we tend to like really look, it's really helpful for us to look at like problems to be solved, right. And as opposed to feeling like we are the problem. And so, um, I find it really helpful to be like, Oh, it's interesting that I always crave chocolate after a meal. So what is that? What is my body telling me? My body is telling me that it's tired and sluggish because it's digesting. And so the chocolate would be a fuel that would sort of get me

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (34:03.594)
Yes. Yes.


Katy Weber (she/her) (34:24.395)
pass that and I'm like, huh, that makes a lot of sense. Thank you, body.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (34:27.458)
Yeah, absolutely. Well, I, I often say to clients to look at what you're binging on and work backwards from that. So if you're binging on real foods that are really high in energy, there's no, we don't demonize foods. There's no negative thing associated with that, but maybe you weren't your energy needs weren't met in the day. Or if you're binging on foods that.

very obviously trying to meet sensory needs, like very crunchy foods and you're sitting there and you can't stop with something that's extremely crunchy. That could be, and you're eating past, you know, past fullness or satisfaction that could be a sign that your sensory needs aren't met for the day. So

Looking at it from that angle can really help people go, Oh yeah, actually mine. Or, or if you're eating foods that provide that the main focus is just that pleasure and you're thinking, Oh, this ice cream is so smooth and delicious. Maybe you're not getting enough pleasure throughout the week or throughout the day in your meals. And you're just craving that pleasurable experience from food, which is our right. It's our right to have pleasurable experiences with food all the time. It's not something that we just have to save up for on the weekend. And when we do that, we usually only have a very small one.

and then feel a lot of guilt and yeah so it doesn't work anyway.

Katy Weber (she/her) (35:43.159)
Uh, yeah, bring it. I mean, the sensory stuff I think is so important to, to think about in terms of like, I talk about mouth, feel a lot with my husband and he's like, what are you talking about? And I was like, I just can't have that in my mouth right now. He's like, what? Um, or safe foods too, right? Like we talk about safe foods. Um, and also, uh, just, um,

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (35:55.202)
Ha ha ha!


Katy Weber (she/her) (36:09.487)
Oh, executive dysfunction, right? Like I think that's the other thing that a lot of us, I certainly struggle with, which is like I, you know, one of my pet peeves is when somebody says like, this is a really easy recipe and it's like, get out a pan and start chopping onions. And I'm like, I'm sorry, you've lost me already. I'm not chopping it right. Or I'm like, my idea of an easy meal is literally just eating peanut butter out of the jar. Like sometimes that's where my executive function is for the day. So I know we call it a.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (36:12.939)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally, totally.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (36:31.714)
Yeah, Peter by the hand, yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (36:37.479)
cheese on hand to sandwich. Um, right. So I think like there, and this is. Right. Oh, okay. Well that's.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (36:44.326)
And that is a perfectly balanced snack, to be fair. Nuts contain carbohydrates, protein and fat. That's perfectly balanced.

Katy Weber (she/her) (36:51.327)
Well, again, right? It's sort of like, am I am I thinking about the you know, am I getting what I need, right? Which I think is why it brings me to the snack hacker, which is brilliant.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (37:05.355)
What did you say?

Katy Weber (she/her) (37:06.131)
I love it. I'm so excited. And I'm going to definitely put a link to it in the show notes because I actually have something like that, but it's not visual. It's just written for my kids on the inside of our pantry for when they get home, um, where I'm just like, here are ideas of carbohydrates and proteins to mix. Uh, and I use it myself more than they do because it's like, oftentimes we get into that just fog of like, I'm hungry. I open the fridge, I close the fridge. I wander around. I open the pantry. Nope.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (37:14.22)

you're brilliant.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (37:29.07)
Right away.

Katy Weber (she/her) (37:34.783)
You know, and then next thing you know, you're like, I guess I'll just eat this box of crackers plane because I have no, like, it's just fatigue or what, like you just can't make decisions. And so, so the snack packer is so brilliant. I'm so excited that it exists. Um, what, where did it come from? Was it just your own brilliant brain?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (37:34.786)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (37:48.55)
Oh, thank you.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (37:53.294)
I, um, how do I answer that without saying yes? Cause I don't know.

Katy Weber (she/her) (37:58.743)
By all means. Well, let's explain what it is, first of all. Okay, so let's talk about what the snack hacker is.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (38:04.678)
So it's just examples of there's one column that has proteins and one column that has carbohydrates and basically just matching one to the other.

just so that your brain and it's all visual. So there's actual pictures of the foods. Yeah. I didn't think it was going to be that groundbreaking and then, but it really was helpful for me. And I thought I'm going to make this visual because, you know, this is how I would want to see it. And then I just thought, I'm going to put it out there. I was really nervous to put it out and then yeah, people really loved it. And I felt so.

Katy Weber (she/her) (38:19.555)
It's pictures. I know, it's so pleasing.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (38:41.762)
privileged to be on people's fridges and in their cupboards. And yeah, it, it, I don't know where it came from. It just was born out of me wanting it myself and knowing that my ADHD clients would really benefit from having it, you know, in the course. Um, and then I thought, Oh, well, I'm might make this available to more people because I don't just want it to be there for people that I, you know.

doing intuitive eating, I think a lot of ADHDers would, or most ADHDers would benefit from something like that.

Katy Weber (she/her) (39:10.655)
Right. And it does, I think it just speaks to so much of what we were talking about in terms of like working memory. Like even if the food is in your house, you forget it exists, right? And just you forget that you can pair foods. Like that's the other thing, which is like sometimes with ADHD, you just simply forget that like

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (39:20.563)

Katy Weber (she/her) (39:29.407)
you can put peanut butter on toast and be like, Oh, I have both of those things. That's wonderful. Like, and there's that, like, it speaks to so much of the complicated executive dysfunction issues that we have a hard time articulating to other people. Cause they're like, what? Like everything's in your house. What's the problem? And you're like, I don't know where to begin. Uh, so just seeing the visuals of these two things, how they can go together. It's, yeah, it's just, it is wonderful.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (39:31.735)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (39:45.294)
Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (39:55.266)
Oh, Katie, thank you so much. You're amazing. I didn't even. Yeah. That's so wonderful that you found that and that you like it. I feel so privileged.

Katy Weber (she/her) (40:05.263)
Oh my goodness. Well, and it's funny because I've talked about it with some of my clients because of the thing that I have with my own kids with just the list because I would never just have the, you know, it never occurred to me to make visuals, but it's so much more appealing. And yeah, just to have it printed and stick it on your fridge or whatever, it's great. And you have a couple of other downloads too, right? You've got the visual food shopping list.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (40:22.423)
Thank you.

Yeah, I made the food shopping list. It's basically for when your brain is just in one of those broken modes. So everything that is on that one page will either trigger you for things that are really essential. So like dog food, if you don't have that, your dog will need kind of thing or your medications and it just triggers those things, but then also all the foods.

they all lead into food suggestions. So there's no recipes because I feel that that's overwhelming for ADHDers. People with ADHD always ask me for recipes and then they come back and they're like, I didn't make that. And I'm like, I'm gonna stop giving recipes unless they're one pot. But.

Yeah, just, it just gives ideas of meals and it's again visual. So if the meal was a pasta dish, it would show the pasta what vegetable to use. And they would all be the vegetables and, and meat and pasta, or there's a vegan and vegetarian, um, shopping lists as well. But yeah, they'd all lead into those meals. So yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (41:24.275)
Right. And I think that's another thing that I feel like we could do our part as ADHD or as ADHD years to, um, to de de stigmatize eating chickpeas in a bowl. Right. Or eating peanut butter on a spoon, because a lot of the time that is what your body needs and like we do crave that really, really simple, um, the flavor simplicity to a lot of the time. Right. Which is like, we don't need, we don't necessarily need to have.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (41:38.078)
Yeah, totally. Totally.

Yes. Yes.

Katy Weber (she/her) (41:54.103)
incredibly well balanced to bully that we're making ourselves every week. Like a lot of the times my meals do consist of a can of tuna and a piece of toast. Right. So, um,

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (41:56.888)

Absolutely me too. Absolutely. And that's fine. And I often say to ADHD is if you want to eat like a kid, then eat like a kid because we have these rules in society that an adult can't have like some crackers and cheese and cut up carrots, but I found throughout my life that

When people would serve food to kids that appealed to me so much more because the vegetables are all separate and they're not, not things like touching. And it's just, it just appeals to me. Like I can handle foods touching and I, you know, but it just appeals to my brain that everything's in its place and they're really simple and you know, not over the top spicy foods and things like that, I like them in context, but yeah. It just.

makes it feel simple and it's okay to eat like a kid it's absolutely fine. I have so many ADHDs that like basically I have Lunchables for my lunch. I'm like good do Lunchables is that a known thing? Oh yeah yeah yeah I'm like that's fine yeah it's absolutely fine it's great.

Katy Weber (she/her) (43:00.756)
Yeah, yeah.

Right? Yeah, I mean, this is why I'm a big fan of meal kits, because I've just, even before I was diagnosed with ADHD, I often would use meal kits when I was cooking. Now I've, most of the time my husband does the cooking because he loves it, but I've really been a big fan of meal kits because there's just very clear rules to follow and...

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (43:26.907)

Katy Weber (she/her) (43:27.803)
And I, for some reason I can get past my own executive dysfunction when it comes to meal kit recipes, I don't know what it is, but it's really fascinating to me because recently my husband was out of town and I didn't have a meal kit delivery set up. And I, so I reached out to my community and was like, I need ideas for recipes. Otherwise I'm going to get takeout for five days in a row. And I can't do that to my poor kids. So I was like, can anybody recommend some really, really basic

recipes and like people kept recommending recipes and I had to be like, I don't think I have fully explained the depths of my executive dysfunction where I was like, I cannot have multiple pans going at the same time. Like I, I was sort of like, I can't have too many steps. And I was like, I can boil water, but like beyond that, I can't have too many things happening at once. So I kept being like, Nope, more basic, Nope, more basic. And then I was like, really?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (44:06.689)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (44:20.446)

Katy Weber (she/her) (44:22.671)
Is it just, are there cans I can dump in an instant pot was really what I ended up with. Yeah.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (44:28.41)
Yeah, that's, and that's fine. I think, yeah, we don't need to have so much pressure on ourselves around those things and it's, yeah, it's absolutely fine to have, to only be able to do those steps like that. I think with the, with the meal kits, do your meal kits have visual recipes? Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (44:48.671)
They do actually. I think that's really helpful because the other thing I really like is that they want to, you know, and I've talked to my husband about this because one of his, his dream projects is to come up with like more ADHD friendly recipe books. Because one of the things that really frustrates me with recipe books is they don't, they don't go through very explicitly like how much to prep and chop things ahead of time. And that's been such a game changer is the fact that you have to do all of that ahead of time. You have to like.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (45:11.182)
100% Yes

Katy Weber (she/her) (45:15.939)
pre-measure because I get to those states where I'm like, I don't read ahead. And then suddenly I'm like, something's on, you know, on a pan. And then it's like, add the cumin. And I was like, what? Yeah. Oh God. I have to go find it. Right. And then I burn it. And so.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (45:27.542)
Yeah, this is burning, yeah, yes.

Katy Weber (she/her) (45:32.527)
Right? And so, you know, and my husband was like, well, no, you measure all of that before you've even begun. And I was like, I don't think that way. I followed the first step and I don't think ahead. And then next week, like I just hit the ground running with recipes. And so one of the things I like about meal kits is they are very explicit before you even start. They're like, do all this chopping and most of the things are often pre-measured too. So yeah, that's, that's right.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (45:44.295)
Yes, yeah.

Yes. Yes. And, and they have that real obvious, oh, that's how the carrot's meant to be chopped. So there's no room for interpretation and, and there's not as much thinking that it's great with the meal kits. And I do think a, um, yeah, tell your husband to let me know if he does that cooking book, cause I'd love to be involved in some way, that's amazing. And I think, um, I think it's really important for ADHDers to.

Katy Weber (she/her) (46:13.249)

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (46:20.938)
find some recipes that they really love and it will be tricky doing them for the first few times but to

almost do them so many times that they just just two or three recipes that they build muscle mess or muscle memory around that recipe so that it it's an autopilot recipe and that does happen. I've done it myself where I've you know I have a cake recipe that's just stored in my head where I can make this one egg chocolate cake from when I was I think 14 years old and I can make it on autopilot. I don't even really have to measure things because that's the ADHD brain right we can I mean I feel that a lot of ADHDs can measure with their eyes and can recognize those things if they

and so I can make this without even doing too much work but having really thinking to yourself this is gonna be something that I'm gonna put the effort into learning the steps over and over and over again make it sort of once a month or once a fortnight until it's an autopilot recipe to kind of keep me

you know, like you said, when your husband went away and you felt really sort of overwhelmed, but you'd have these in your back pocket to know that you could make and it's ideal if you can kind of change out a few of the ingredients so that it can, it's not always the same, but yeah, finding an autopilot recipe or putting some effort into creating one or two autopilot recipes is a great thing to do.

Katy Weber (she/her) (47:35.563)
Mm hmm. Yeah. Right. Um, yeah, Pinterest is great for that. Uh, the, um, what was I going to say? Oh, I remember when I was younger, I spent a summer in Sri Lanka. And so I was taught a lot of Sri Lankan and South Indian cooking and like, they don't use measuring spoons or anything. And it's so funny how much of that stayed with me. I really enjoy cooking, um, like pot meals where you're basically adding flavor based on you.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (47:39.883)


Katy Weber (she/her) (48:01.671)
you know, tasting it and being like, what does this need? And they always had these really great, you know, like you would measure your finger to the first knuckle for how much water goes in with pasta and all of that rice. And it was so much. And I was like, now I realize I'm like, Oh, that's so much more friendly to my brain and why baking is so hard for me because baking is so exact and so many rules. And like, you know, and, and like, um, I, you know, I was trying something the other day where I was dipping a

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (48:09.767)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (48:21.659)
Yeah. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (48:29.023)
measuring cup into flour. And my husband was like, no, no, no, you don't want to do that. You want to weigh it. Because the dipping of the flour, the measuring cup, like compresses the flour too much, and then you get it. You get an incorrect. I know. And I was like, I quit. Like I'm done. But like, I was like, I.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (48:41.243)
Oh, I didn't know that.

No. No. Yeah. Have to have a physics degree to... No. I can't. No.

Katy Weber (she/her) (48:52.167)
I know, right. But he loves that stuff. Yeah, and so it's so funny to be like, my daughter and my husband love the exactness of faking. And I'm just like, way too chaotic. I'm like, no, I'm like, I love being able to just like, improvise as I go along.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (49:09.69)
Yeah. And that's where your autopilot recipe for something like cookies would be like a Anzac recipe where you're like, it's just got to be sticky enough at the end to work and then you can, you can be creative with it. That's what I encourage ADHD is to do is find recipes that are really lenient and that you find you can be a little bit creative with, because also doing the same thing over and over again, hurts our brain. So just finding that thing that.

Katy Weber (she/her) (49:20.349)

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (49:36.086)
is, is, yeah, doesn't have as much pressure on it and kind of works out every time. The foolproof things. Yeah. I'll find a partner that cooks for me. That's also great.

Katy Weber (she/her) (49:43.125)
Or find a partner who cooks for you. That's my advice too. That's been fascinating. I love talking about food and ADHD. I think it's so many of us are so confounded by our relationships with food. And I think so many of us.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (50:01.846)

Katy Weber (she/her) (50:03.355)
Especially when you bring weight and we didn't even get to talk about like weight stigma and doctors and the, you know, the overwhelming pressure to lose weight as a way of achieving health, I think is a whole other that we could have, I could have you back for a whole other episode about that. Uh, but you know, you have, um, so you have a group coaching program as well. How can people find you? Okay. Well, I'll, I'll definitely have a link to all of your downloadables because they are so beautiful and wonder. And just like, so I, I just.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (50:23.206)

Thank you.

Katy Weber (she/her) (50:33.243)
It's such a great idea. So I'll definitely have a link to that, but then you also have a group coaching program, right?

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (50:35.15)
Thank you.

Yes. Yeah. I do 12 week group coaching programs, small group coaching programs, um, that I run a few times a year and they are my absolute passion. It's just so beautiful to have a group of people come together and we, we go through the steps of intuitive eating and through the lens of ADHD and getting in tune with your body and finding food freedom and feeling that confidence to. Not.

have to live inside diet culture's rules anymore. Um, and yeah, I'm actually running another group really soon. So I'll be putting out the wait list for that. And yeah, I'm really excited to, to continue doing that. Cause it's, it's such a beautiful experience to be a part of. Honestly, I feel so privileged when I work with women and see their changes. And yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (51:32.283)
Right. And I think it's also just a reminder that it's not, I think people feel very stubborn about getting help around intuitive eating because they feel like intuitive eating should be freedom and no rules, right? And how important it is to really have professional guidance on this journey. But it really, you know, that because otherwise I think you just end up.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (51:46.132)


Katy Weber (she/her) (51:55.991)
frustrated. And like I said, that's kind of the, you're still in diet mode. Um, you're just in the, I'm failing at diet mode part of dieting in white cycling. Um, and yeah, go ahead. I was just going to say like for people with ADHD, especially, I think community and help and, and continued continued support, I think is such a really important for us. So yeah.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (52:00.599)
Yes. Yeah.

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes and I'm not sorry. Sorry to interrupt you go. Oh.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (52:14.305)

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (52:21.522)
Yes, which is what we have in the program. So there's a Slack channel and people love that because they can stay on there for as long as they all want to and support each other after the program's finished, which is absolutely amazing. And I think going back to your last point, what people don't realize is that food freedom, there shouldn't be any food rules. So you shouldn't need help with it. But

You don't realize the amount of stuff that you have to unlearn because of the culture that we live in and how much, how hard it is to unlearn those rules. Um, it's, it's a, you know, it's a difficult process to do on your own. And yeah, it's.

It's so great to do it with other people and to have that support because there's, there's a lot of weight stigma out there and there's, and intuitive eating isn't as widely known as people think it is in the States. It's a lot more widely known, but in Australia it's really fresh. And so many people, I explain it to, I think there's one in 20 people that I talk to know kind of what it is. So to have other people that understand and can support you through that process and you can go, Oh my God, you know what someone said to me today? And they're ready to go. It's okay. Just remember that's coming from.

you know, their own family history of food rules and, you know, to have that support is so important. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (53:35.915)
Yeah, it's funny that you say that because I feel like in my own diet recovery journey over the years, I always felt like Australia was like at the forefront of body positivity. And, you know, like I just, I think it's because the Embrace documentary was so huge for me when I saw that years ago, and it was such, it was so pivotal and seminal for me. And I'm, why am I forgetting her

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (53:53.083)


Tara Breuso (Sofair) (54:04.97)
I am too. I was just, I was like, I need to say her name. Um, okay. It starts with T and I can't think of it. Brum, Brumfit is her surname. Brum, Tyron or Tyron. Tyron. I think it is Tyron. Tyron Brumfit. Yeah. Um,

Katy Weber (she/her) (54:07.563)
I'll put it in the show notes. Just look it up really quick. I don't know, I'm like, I know, right? I'm like, Brumfit, Tara Brumfit, right? It is also Tara, yeah. Taryn Brumfit, yes, okay, thank you. I'll put a link to that documentary. It comes and goes on Netflix in the US, but like, I don't know, I've always thought of Australia as being like so much more.

so much more reasonable in terms of body positivity than the US when it comes to diet culture.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (54:38.566)
Maybe we are in terms of body positivity, but when it comes to food, there's not that same understanding. It's the intuitive eating part. It's the, oh, okay. Maybe, maybe what I eat doesn't define who I am as much as I thought it did. And maybe the way I eat is not my fault. You know, maybe there's something more to this.

Katy Weber (she/her) (54:42.433)

Well, I mean, Vegemite, I don't know. Ha ha ha.

Katy Weber (she/her) (55:05.373)
That's definitely an acquired taste, I know.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (55:05.564)
It's delicious. It's delicious and I will die on this hill. It really is, honestly.

Katy Weber (she/her) (55:14.809)
You're like, food doesn't define who I am. And I'm like, excuse me.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (55:19.906)
It's the ratios. The Americans just don't understand the ratios, Katie. It's...

Katy Weber (she/her) (55:24.923)
It's true. We can't have anything and we can't have anything in like small amounts. Awesome. Well, thank you so much. This has been so lovely to chat with you. I wanted to ask if you had a, did you have a name for ADHD? If you could call it something else.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (55:41.574)
Okay, so I thought about this and I talked to my husband about it earlier and I wouldn't change the name. I have had because of my son and

I've been talking about him possibly being neurodivergent to people and they say, Oh, do you really want to label him with that? And my response is always, I think that people only say that when they think that the label is a negative thing. And I don't believe ADHD is a negative thing. It's make certain things trickier for him, but

There's so many things that are amazing about him and he is who he is and he has ADHD very likely. Um, and you know, if I said that he was exceptional at sport, if I gave him that label, no one would say, are you sure that you want to label him as that? You know? So no, I've been working on being, I've always tried to be really positive about the ADHD label and I don't see the full words anymore in my head. I don't see attention deficit.

hyperactivity disorder. I just see ADHD more as a symbol. Like it's more, it's just the acronym is a symbol to me that means so many things and it's really positive for me. And going forward when people respond like, oh, are you sure that you wanna label him like that? Yeah, I do. I absolutely do because it's absolutely fine and beautiful for him to have ADHD. So yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (56:44.369)

That is, I love that response. It reminds me of like KFC. We don't call it Kentucky fried chicken anymore. They just changed it to KFC or Weight Watchers did the same thing, right? They were like, we're not Weight Watchers were WW and you're like, yeah. Okay. But no.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (57:06.802)
Oh, thank you.

And KFC is delicious. We still know. And I also love the, I love that, I love that with a, a neurodivergence that prides itself on being messy and, and

you know, feeling like we're not always saying the right thing that our, the description of what it is, isn't correct. I love that. It just feels like it fits. Yeah. Like the person didn't write it down right. That, that makes complete sense to me. Yeah.

Katy Weber (she/her) (57:48.771)
We need a copy editor. Hahaha. Ugh.

Oh my God, I love that. Uh, no, but it is really, it is sweet. Like how much, uh, how, what the word ADHD has become for us is really, that's really sweet. Oh, I like that answer. Thank you. Um, all right. Well, thank you. Yeah. Thank you, Tara. It's been super wonderful. So it's the underscore ADHD underscore dietitian with a T not a C people. Um,

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (58:09.146)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, thank you so much.

Yeah. Thank you. Yes.

Katy Weber (she/her) (58:26.951)
Right? And that's both on Instagram and TikTok. I'll have links to both of those. But yeah, thank you so much. It's been really wonderful getting to know you. All right.

Tara Breuso (Sofair) (58:32.722)
Yes. Oh, thank you.

Oh, it's been a dream. Thank you so much, Katie. Thank you.